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 Minimum number of people to cover 24/7?
Metalrain  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 4:16:28 PM
I've been asked by my boss to go from an 16 hour workday to 24 hour. At present full time employees work 4 10hr days a week. Two people cover a 16 hour day with 4 hours of overlap. Some overlap is needed to allow one person to leave to do stuff offsite. At least one person must be on site at all times. Someone has to be here every day of the year.

Is there software (free) that does scheduling?

We have 4 full time employees and one part time.

Any and all help appreciated..
Metalrain  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 5:22:30 PM
Falling rapidly on page four........must bring back to top.







bump.
IshootARs  [Member]
6/24/2008 5:24:07 PM
what do you do?

Do you have to be alert or is it a warm body job?

Metalrain  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 5:27:11 PM
Alert.. Drinking water plant
ghengiskhabb  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 5:27:49 PM

Originally Posted By Metalrain:
I've been asked by my boss to go from an 16 hour workday to 24 hour. At present full time employees work 4 10hr days a week. Two people cover a 16 hour day with 4 hours of overlap. Some overlap is needed to allow one person to leave to do stuff offsite. At least one person must be on site at all times. Someone has to be here every day of the year.


168 hours per week.
4.2 full time heads minimum.

Other than that, you are on your own. Free bump
SmilingBandit  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 5:29:40 PM
I'd imagine you could use a schedule similar to the PD here. 12 hour days, one week you work Mon, Tues, Fri, Sat, Sun. Next week you work Wed, Thurs. You end up having a few too many hours so every few weeks you get an extra day off. You could probably handle that with a floater.
ZW17  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 5:30:40 PM
Is it not a OSHA safety violation to have only one guy working in a plant?

That is assuming you work in a water plant.
learath  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 5:33:33 PM

Originally Posted By ghengiskhabb:

Originally Posted By Metalrain:
I've been asked by my boss to go from an 16 hour workday to 24 hour. At present full time employees work 4 10hr days a week. Two people cover a 16 hour day with 4 hours of overlap. Some overlap is needed to allow one person to leave to do stuff offsite. At least one person must be on site at all times. Someone has to be here every day of the year.


168 hours per week.
4.2 full time heads minimum.

Other than that, you are on your own. Free bump

That assumes no vacation, no overlap, no sick time, no Nothing.
Rational is 8, you can squeeze by with 6 mostly.
Gorias  [Member]
6/24/2008 5:39:30 PM
We do 12 hr shifts with a 3-4 schedule.

week 1 I work Sun - Tue
week 2 I work Sun - Wed

The opposite shift would work all the other days. This will not have any overlap with only 4 people, if you really want that you need 2 more, one on days and one on nights. That additional person would float between Mon-Fri depending on need. You may be able to accomplish this with the part timer but you would have to be creative with it.
Metalrain  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 5:42:17 PM

Originally Posted By ZW17:
Is it not a OSHA safety violation to have only one guy working in a plant?

That is assuming you work in a water plant.


Could be, we're a small system. I'd like two guys at all time but thats not happening anytime soon. I luckly I've got the help thats here now. A few years ago there was but two of us. Either he was working or I was.

With holidays and vacations it hard to keep the place staffed. Two of the guys get 4 weeks vacation a year.
ZW17  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 5:49:14 PM

Originally Posted By Metalrain:

Originally Posted By ZW17:
Is it not a OSHA safety violation to have only one guy working in a plant?

That is assuming you work in a water plant.


Could be, we're a small system. I'd like two guys at all time but thats not happening anytime soon. I luckly I've got the help thats here now. A few years ago there was but two of us. Either he was working or I was.

With holidays and vacations it hard to keep the place staffed. Two of the guys get 4 weeks vacation a year.


I would be raising hell over that.

What happens if you get hurt and can't get help? How do you handle 2 man jobs like changing a pump? Do you deal with high voltages?

I don't know the layout of your job but if it's how I picture it, it seems VERY dangerous to only staff one person at a time?
mace  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 6:00:26 PM
We cover 24/7 with three people at one of our positions. 12 hour shifts, every week one person works days, another works nights, and the third is off for the week. The next week, they rotate. So every person gets 2 weeks on, 1 week off. Well, there's maybe a half-hour to hour handover time between days and nights.

Of course, we don't need as much overlap, and we also have a large pool of other employees to cover in vacation and sick time gaps.

Maybe you could take your four full-time employees and do something like 14-16 hour days for everyone for the overlap, each week one person works days and another works nights while the other two are off for the week, and they rotate every week. Use the part-time to fill in gaps, depending on what kind of schedule and predictability he expects. So your full-time guys get 1 week on, 1 week off (or maybe 2 on, 2 off?). Hopefully, the extra part-timer and a little flexibility plus the standard week or two off at a time will cover for vacation time, sick leave, etc.

Are you paying by the hour/day, or salary? Time based pay will probably make it easier to get people to work extra every now and then to cover any gaps.
Metalrain  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 6:00:49 PM

Originally Posted By ZW17:

Originally Posted By Metalrain:

Originally Posted By ZW17:
Is it not a OSHA safety violation to have only one guy working in a plant?

That is assuming you work in a water plant.


Could be, we're a small system. I'd like two guys at all time but thats not happening anytime soon. I luckly I've got the help thats here now. A few years ago there was but two of us. Either he was working or I was.

With holidays and vacations it hard to keep the place staffed. Two of the guys get 4 weeks vacation a year.


I would be raising hell over that.


What happens if you get hurt and can't get help? How do you handle 2 man jobs like changing a pump? Do you deal with high voltages?

I don't know the layout of your job but if it's how I picture it, it seems VERY dangerous to only staff one person at a time?


Most of the time its simple stuff, running lab tests, backwashing filters, housecleaning and the like. Some jobs are dangerous, we deal with some very dangerous chemicals, confined spaces, and even boating in high water. There is aways two or more here when something risking is happening.

Its alot better than it used to be and it is getting better.
Metalrain  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 6:10:49 PM

Originally Posted By mace:
Are you paying by the hour/day, or salary? Time based pay will probably make it easier to get people to work extra every now and then to cover any gaps.


Hourly. Although they (management) don't like giving overtime.
ZW17  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 7:07:30 PM

Originally Posted By Metalrain:

Originally Posted By ZW17:

Originally Posted By Metalrain:

Originally Posted By ZW17:
Is it not a OSHA safety violation to have only one guy working in a plant?

That is assuming you work in a water plant.


Could be, we're a small system. I'd like two guys at all time but thats not happening anytime soon. I luckly I've got the help thats here now. A few years ago there was but two of us. Either he was working or I was.

With holidays and vacations it hard to keep the place staffed. Two of the guys get 4 weeks vacation a year.


I would be raising hell over that.


What happens if you get hurt and can't get help? How do you handle 2 man jobs like changing a pump? Do you deal with high voltages?

I don't know the layout of your job but if it's how I picture it, it seems VERY dangerous to only staff one person at a time?


Most of the time its simple stuff, running lab tests, backwashing filters, housecleaning and the like. Some jobs are dangerous, we deal with some very dangerous chemicals, confined spaces, and even boating in high water. There is aways two or more here when something risking is happening.

Its alot better than it used to be and it is getting better.


Right on.

Just remember that no job is worth your life or safety. If you are not comfortable, refuse to do it.

I am just looking out for you and yours bro.
CommoMan  [Member]
6/24/2008 7:19:06 PM
I'm sure that there is software available to do this but the Mark I brain is a more economical solution.

From my experience in the Air Force:

For twenty four hour coverage with 8 hour shifts you need five crews.

For twenty four hour coverage with 12 hour shifts you need four crews.

If you don't have enough people to fill all these slots you can get by with less temporarily. However, you will soon find your workforce burned out and ready to quit.
learath  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 7:32:01 PM

Originally Posted By CommoMan:
I'm sure that there is software available to do this but the Mark I brain is a more economical solution.

From my experience in the Air Force:

For twenty four hour coverage with 8 hour shifts you need five crews.

For twenty four hour coverage with 12 hour shifts you need four crews.

If you don't have enough people to fill all these slots you can get by with less temporarily. However, you will soon find your workforce burned out and ready to quit.

Crews and people are different.
Also, that sounds military, which is again different.
Metalrain  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 7:45:59 PM

Originally Posted By learath:
Also, that sounds military, which is again different.


You can say that again. There's a retired military that just been hired in another dept. and he's got the management ear right now. Looks like my paperwork is going up about 500%. Document everything is the new phrase. yippee
1Bigdog  [Team Member]
6/24/2008 8:43:20 PM
There are 21 - 8 hr turns in a week(7 days at 3 - 8 hr turns per day)

Day (7AM to 3PM) person works 5 turns Monday to Friday

Afternoon (3PM to 11PM) person works 5 turns Wednesday to Sunday

Midnight (11PM to 7AM) person works 5 turns Friday to Tuesday.

Swing person works 6 - 8 hr days. Saturday @ Sunday day turn, Monday and Tuesday afternoon turn and Wednesday and Thursday Midnight turn

Everybody switches turns each week (or not)

4 people in total with only 8 hours of overtime per week.
Metalrain  [Team Member]
6/25/2008 9:16:50 AM
I've tried some online scheduling software and not having any luck getting it to do what I what.


Some overlap is needed to allow one person to leave to do stuff offsite.
At least one person must be on site at all times.
Someone has to be here every day of the year.

Bump for day crew.

And thanks to the posters who have replied.

poliscifan  [Member]
6/25/2008 9:36:41 AM

Originally Posted By CommoMan:
I'm sure that there is software available to do this but the Mark I brain is a more economical solution.

From my experience in the Air Force:

For twenty four hour coverage with 8 hour shifts you need five crews.

For twenty four hour coverage with 12 hour shifts you need four crews.

If you don't have enough people to fill all these slots you can get by with less temporarily. However, you will soon find your workforce burned out and ready to quit.


This would be my worry, if you have 1 person quit you will have serious problems, if 2 people quit you will have a catastrophe.

doggscube  [Member]
6/25/2008 9:49:35 AM

Originally Posted By SmilingBandit:
I'd imagine you could use a schedule similar to the PD here. 12 hour days, one week you work Mon, Tues, Fri, Sat, Sun. Next week you work Wed, Thurs. You end up having a few too many hours so every few weeks you get an extra day off. You could probably handle that with a floater.


Since they're hourly, "comp time" does not apply. OT must be paid per DOL.
whiskerz  [Member]
6/25/2008 9:51:26 AM
look for a thing called the Dupont schedule it works 12's and does a 36 hour one week with a 48 the next , it is supposed to work well when you are understaffed
Evil_Ed  [Life Member]
6/25/2008 9:54:15 AM
We're 24//6 here where I am, we get by with 7 guys.

For the overnight shifts we have only one guy per shift but they have an overlap of a few hours. If any of the overnight guys is sick or out, one of the day shift guys needs to switch shifts...which is a real bitch. Admittidly one of our guys is working from remote, and is not physically here.

I'd go with minimum 8 if I were you. Even then that's a skeleton crew and with almost no ability to be flexable should more than one person be sick for a couple days, take a vacation for a week or two, etc. And, as others have mentioned, God forbid someone gets injured or something and isn't near any kind of comms.

At least where I am, there's piles of phones around, so if something bad happens, our guys can reach out..

JakeThePimp  [Team Member]
6/25/2008 10:03:42 AM
All I can say is I feel for you brother. I worked that skeleton crew/must have man on type of stuff. It got old really quick, the day I started looking for another job was when one guy was on vacation and another called in sick. Thing is, it wasn't for lack of money we could have easily hired several more competent people it was just stupid management.

-JTP
wvar15  [Team Member]
6/25/2008 10:05:25 AM
I've covered 24x7 with 5. You could do it with 4 if OT is not a problem.
Leadbutt  [Team Member]
6/25/2008 10:05:39 AM
I would also be interested in a software program that would work with alternative scheduling.

4-ten hour days would be better for a lot of folks due to commutes. Then there is the bonus of three days off!!! If you sometimes schedule your days off back to back, you get a mini vacation of 6 days!!!

It is also better for employers. Employers get an a half hour meal break, two coffee breaks and cleanup time as a bonus every week. That is at least an hour every week of productive time. After 50 weeks it is more than a week of "free" productivity.